11. The applicant subsequently edited and cut the film of the interview down to a few minutes. On 21 July 1985 this was broadcast by Danmarks Radio as a part of the Sunday News Magazine. The programme consisted of a variety of items, for instance on the martial law in South Africa, on the debate on profit-sharing in Denmark and on the late German writer Heinrich Böll. The transcript of the Greenjackets item reads as follows [(I): TV presenter; (A): the applicant; (G): one or other of the Greenjackets]:
(I) "In recent years, a great deal has been said about racism in Denmark. The papers are currently publishing stories about distrust and resentment directed against minorities. Who are the people who hate the minorities? Where do they come from? What is their mentality like? Mr Jens Olaf Jersild has visited a group of extremist youths at Østerbro in Copenhagen.
(A) The flag on the wall is the flag of the Southern States from the American Civil War, but today it is also the symbol of racism, the symbol of the American movement, the Ku Klux Klan, and it shows what Lille Steen, Henrik and Nisse are.
Are you a racist?
(G) Yes, that’s what I regard myself as. It’s good being a racist. We believe Denmark is for the Danes.
(A) Henrik, Lille Steen and all the others are members of a group of young people who live in Studsgårdsgade, called STUDSEN, in Østerbro in Copenhagen. It is public housing, a lot of the inhabitants are unemployed and on social security; the crime rate is high. Some of the young people in this neighbourhood have already been involved in criminal activities and have already been convicted.
(G) It was an ordinary armed robbery at a petrol station.
(A) What did you do?
(G) Nothing. I just ran into a petrol station with a ... gun and made them give me some money. Then I ran out again. That’s all.
(A) What about you, what happened?
(G) I don’t wish to discuss that further.
(A) But, was it violence?
(G) Yes.
(A) You have just come out of ... you have been arrested, what were you arrested for?
(G) Street violence.
(A) What happened?
(G) I had a little fight with the police together with some friends.
(A) Does that happen often?
(G) Yes, out here it does.
(A) All in all, there are 20-25 young people from STUDSEN in the same group.
They meet not far away from the public housing area near some old houses which are to be torn down. They meet here to reaffirm among other things their racism, their hatred of immigrants and their support for the Ku Klux Klan.
(G) The Ku Klux Klan, that’s something that comes from the States in the old days during - you know - the civil war and things like that, because the Northern States wanted that the niggers should be free human beings, man, they are not human beings, they are animals, right, it’s completely wrong, man, the things that happened. People should be allowed to keep slaves, I think so anyway.
(A) Because blacks are not human beings?
(G) No, you can also see that from their body structure, man, big flat noses, with cauliflower ears etc., man. Broad heads and very broad bodies, man, hairy, you are looking at a gorilla and compare it with an ape, man, then it is the same [behaviour], man, it’s the same movements, long arms, man, long fingers etc., long feet.
(A) A lot of people are saying something different. There are a lot of people who say, but ...
(G) Just take a picture of a gorilla, man, and then look at a nigger, it’s the same body structure and everything, man, flat forehead and all kinds of things.
(A) There are many blacks, for example in the USA, who have important jobs.
(G) Of course, there is always someone who wants to show off, as if they are better than the white man, but in the long run, it’s the white man who is better.
(A) What does Ku Klux Klan mean to you?
(G) It means a great deal, because I think what they do is right. A nigger is not a human being, it’s an animal, that goes for all the other foreign workers as well, Turks, Yugoslavs and whatever they are called.
(A) Henrik is 19 years old and on welfare. He lives in a rented room in Studsgårdsgade. Henrik is one of the strongest supporters of the Klan, and he hates the foreign workers, ‘Perkere’ [a very derogatory word in Danish for immigrant workers].
(G) They come up here, man, and sponge on our society. But we, we have enough problems in getting our social benefits, man, they just get it. Fuck, we can argue with those idiots up there at the social benefit office to get our money, man, they just get it, man, they are the first on the housing list, they get better flats than us, man, and some of our friends who have children, man, they are living in the worst slum, man, they can’t even get a shower in their flat, man, then those ‘Perkere’-families, man, go up there with seven kids, man, and they just get an expensive flat, right there and then. They get everything paid, and things like that, that can’t be right, man, Denmark is for the Danes, right?
It is the fact that they are ‘Perkere’, that’s what we don’t like, right, and we don’t like their mentality - I mean they can damn well, I mean ... what’s it called ... I mean if they feel like speaking Russian in their homes, right, then it’s okay, but what we don’t like is when they walk around in those Zimbabwe-clothes and then speak this hula-hula language in the street, and if you ask them something or if you get into one of their taxis then they say: I don’t know where it is, you give directions right.
(A) Is it not so that perhaps you are a bit envious that some of the ‘Perkere’ as you call them have their own shops, and cars, they can make ends ...
(G) It’s drugs they are selling, man, half of the prison population in ‘Vestre’ are in there because of drugs, man, half of those in Vestre prison anyway, they are the people who are serving time for dealing drugs or something similar.
They are in there, all the ‘Perkere’, because of drugs, right. [That] must be enough, what’s it called, there should not be drugs here in this country, but if it really has to be smuggled in, I think we should do it ourselves, I mean, I think it’s unfair that those foreigners come up here to ... what’s it called ... make Denmark more drug dependent and things like that.
We have painted their doors and hoped that they would get fed up with it, so that they would soon leave, and jumped on their cars and thrown paint in their faces when they were lying in bed sleeping.
(A) What was it you did with that paint - why paint?
(G) Because it was white paint, I think that suited them well, that was the intended effect.
(A) You threw paint through the windows of an immigrant family?
(G) Yes.
(A) What happened?
(G) He just got it in his face, that’s all. Well, I think he woke up, and then he came out and shouted something in his hula-hula language.
(A) Did he report it to the police?
(G) I don’t know if he did, I mean, he won’t get anywhere by doing that.
(A) Why not?
(G) I don’t know, it’s just kid’s stuff, like other people throwing water in people’s faces, he got paint in his. They can’t make anything out of that.
---
(A) Per Axholt, known as ‘Pax’ [(P)], is employed in the youth centre in Studsgårdsgade. He has worked there for several years, but many give up a lot sooner because of the tough environment. Per Axholt feels that the reasons why the young people are persecuting the immigrants is that they are themselves powerless and disappointed.
What do you think they would say that they want, if you asked them?
(P) Just what you and I want. Some control over their lives, work which may be considered decent and which they like, a reasonable economic situation, a reasonably functioning family, a wife or a husband and some children, a reasonable middle-class life such as you and I have.
(A) They do many things which are sure to prevent them from getting it.
(P) That is correct.
(A) Why do you think they do this?
(P) Because they have nothing better to do. They have been told over a long period that the means by which to achieve success is money. They won’t be able to get money legitimately, so often they try to obtain it through criminal activity. Sometimes they succeed, sometimes not, and that’s why we see a lot of young people in that situation go to prison, because it doesn’t work.
---
(A) How old were you when you started your criminal activities?
(G) I don’t know, about 14 I guess.
(A) What did you do?
(G) The first time, I can’t remember, I don’t know, burglary.
(A) Do you have what one might call a criminal career?
(G) I don’t know if you can call it that.
(A) You committed your first crime when you were 14.
(G) Well, you can put it that way, I mean, if that is a criminal career. If you have been involved in crime since the age of 15 onwards, then I guess you can say I’ve had a criminal career.
(A) Will you tell me about some of the things you have done?
(G) No, not really. It’s been the same over and over again. There has been pinching of videos, where the ‘Perkere’ have been our customers, so they have money. If people want to be out here and have a nice time and be racists and drink beer, and have fun, then it’s quite obvious you don’t want to sit in the slammer.
(A) But is the threat of imprisonment something that really deters people from doing something illegal?
(G) No, it’s not prison, that doesn’t frighten people.
(A) Is that why you hear stories about people from out here fighting with knives etc., night after night. Is the reason for this the fact that they are not afraid of the police getting hold of them?
(G) Yes, nothing really comes of it, I mean, there are no bad consequences, so probably that’s why. For instance fights and stabbings and smashing up things ... If you really get into the joint it would be such a ridiculously small sentence, so it would be, I mean ... usually we are released the next day. Last time we caused some trouble over at the pub, they let us out the next morning. Nothing really comes of it. It doesn’t discourage us, but there were five of us, who just came out and then we had a celebration for the last guy, who came out yesterday, they probably don’t want to go in again for some time so they probably won’t commit big crimes again.
(A) You would like to move back to Studsgårdsgade where you grew up, but we know for sure that it’s an environment with a high crime rate. Would you like your child to grow up like you?
(G) No, and I don’t think she will. Firstly, because she is a girl, statistics show that the risk is not that high, I mean they probably don’t do it, but you don’t have to be a criminal because you live in an environment with a high crime rate. I just wouldn’t accept it, if she was mugging old women and stealing their handbags.
(A) What if she was among those beating up the immigrants etc. What then?
(G) That would be okay. I wouldn’t have anything against that.
---
(I) We will have to see if the mentality of this family changes in the next generation. Finally, we would like to say that groups of young people like this one in STUDSEN at Østerbro, have been formed elsewhere in Copenhagen."
